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Message Digest
Volume 28 : Issue 278 : "text" Format
Messages in this Issue:
Re: NYPD knows who you've been talking to. And where you've been..
Re: For Americans, Plastic Buys Less Abroad
Re: Western Union's satellite loss
Re: NYPD knows who you've been talking to. And where you've been..
Re: Western Union's satellite loss
Re: Western Union's satellite loss
Re: Email scams: it's different when it's personal
Re: FCC Chairman: Bandwidth Shortage Threatens Future of Cell Phones
Another T-Mo service to bite the dust
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Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 18:43:41 +1100
From: David Clayton <dcstar@NOSPAM.myrealbox.com>
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: NYPD knows who you've been talking to. And where you've been..
Message-ID: <pan.2009.10.09.07.43.38.645171@NOSPAM.myrealbox.com>
> ***** Moderator's Note *****
>
> As I said, tracking data is only useful when combined with other
> information, but even then it poses problems: the cell phone may be at
> a particular place at a particular time, and a prosecutor may be able to
> prove that, but proving that a particular individual was at the place,
> at that time, requires corroboration via other data.
>
> Paradoxically, it may become a valid defense for an accused person to
> state under oath that (s)he switched his/her phone with someone else
> because (s)he don't like the government being able to track his/her
> movements.
It isn't just governments, anyone who can get their hands on this
information can effectively track someone for any sort of nefarious
purpose - I wonder how much the industrial espionage sector has benefited
by having access to the effective movement patterns of individuals
courtesy of the equipment the individual themselves use?
The argument that this data - which is in the hands of private companies -
is secure may not hold much water with those who have seen supposedly
confidential data leak out of these places on a regular basis - and we
only ever hear about a fraction of the actual number of security breaches!
--
Regards, David.
David Clayton
Melbourne, Victoria, Australia.
Knowledge is a measure of how many answers you have, intelligence is a
measure of how many questions you have.
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 2009 13:49:24 +0000 (UTC)
From: ranck@vt.edu
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: For Americans, Plastic Buys Less Abroad
Message-ID: <hanf14$l1$1@solaris.cc.vt.edu>
David Clayton <dcstar@nospam.myrealbox.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 07 Oct 2009 15:13:29 -0400, ranck wrote:
> > Uh, it should be much simpler than that. Really, all the card needs to
> > "remember" is how much has been used as a total, it doesn't need to
> > store transaction details. I'm not saying they don't store those
> > details, but they really should not need to, and the merchant's machine
> > has no need to be able to query previous transactions. It only needs to
> > query how much "money" is available. If I were designing such a
> > card/chip system and wanted to store transactions on the card itself I'd
> > encrypt those so merchants could not get the info and only report back a
> > maximum allowable charge amount when queried. But why store them at
> > all?
> >
> Unfortunately the simple "Is the transaction under the limit" test doesn't
> really work if the card number has also been used in a non-swipe mode,
> such as an Internet purchase, where the chip does not get (immediately)
> updated. Even using the card on non-chip EFTPOS terminals will not update
> that info.
But, none of that is mitigated by storing some transactions on the
card/chip, so why bother?
> > Do you know for a fact this info is stored on the card/chip? Do you
> > have a reference to an article or technical description?
> >
> I don't have any specifics at the moment, but I recall being told at an
> industry conference a year or so ago that one of the "features" of these
> chip cards was that they would hold sufficient information/ability to do
> off-line approvals of transactions based on previous use patterns - all in
> the name of improved security.
That pattern matching could be done on the card/chip and result in a
yes/no report back to the merchant's machine. Again, no need to allow
merchant machines to query transaction information from the card. In
fact, the credit card companies probably consider transaction and
purchase pattern info as a valuable resource, so they are unlikely to
allow a merchant system to query it. It would also be illegal in some
situations I can think of.
I understand your concern. I just don't think any rational credit card
company would allow any merchant to query transactions off a card.
Bill Ranck
Blacksburg, Va.
Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 07:48:49 -0700
From: AES <siegman@stanford.edu>
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: Western Union's satellite loss
Message-ID: <siegman-4EEE75.07484909102009@news.stanford.edu>
In article
<965befa0-efc4-4515-b20e-1111430a7c47@e34g2000vbm.googlegroups.com>,
hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com wrote:
>
> (This was the same bane of commuter railroads--the capital investment
> of trains and stations had to be big enough to handle the rush hours,
> but most of the time the investment was idle.)
>
Just realized: Can't recall ever seeing that same line of argument
(capital investment, operating and maintenance and insurance and medical
costs, and fraction of time idle) applied to the family car (and then
integrated over a community, of course).
***** Moderator's Note *****
Ah, but having a car means you are in charge of your life and can do
whatever you want. ;-)
Ask any advertising executive: the investment isn't in the
capability, it's in the possibility.
Bill Horne, who has got to get that muffler fixed today ...
Moderator
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 2009 17:34:32 +0100
From: Peter R Cook <PCook@wisty.plus.com>
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: NYPD knows who you've been talking to. And where you've been..
Message-ID: <0b9x+fEYY2zKFwsr@wisty.plus.com>
In message <1ojtc5lveosr7lvvf0kuov5hrssvavua5d@4ax.com>, "Tony Toews
[MVP]" <ttoews@telusplanet.net> writes
>hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com wrote:
>
>>> Question to our knowledgable folk here: is enough of the phone's ID
>>> transmitted in the clear when it does the periodic "here I am" ping
>>> that people could track it? (Aside from the cellco, of course).
>>>
>>> In other words, could the NYPD, now that it's got this database, use
>>> its own receivers to keep maps of everyone's travel?
>>
>>An enormous number of people in NYC are on their cell phones at any
>>given moment. Even with today's technology I suspect the volume of
>>calls and callers would be too high to be tracked.
>
>If the cell phone system can track the mere existence of a cell phone
>and it's nearest tower and if the software exists in the cell command
>and control ssytem then I see no reason why the "volume of calls and
>callers would be too high to be tracked." Just throw some more
>hardware at the problem.
>
>Tony
Try
www.childlocate.co.uk
--
Peter R Cook
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 2009 10:35:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: Western Union's satellite loss
Message-ID: <68bd3da9-943f-4510-a689-208704c5c16c@t2g2000yqn.googlegroups.com>
On Oct 9, 1:14 am, John Levine <jo...@iecc.com> wrote:
> For commuter railroads, the biggest problem was competition from
> highways that were publicly funded and paid no taxes. I agree
> that streetcards were killed by the well known NCL conspiracy
> between GM and oil companies.
That was clearly demonstrated in Philadelphia. After the NCL takeover
the system immediately purchased 1,000 GMC buses to replace
streetcars.
Telecom refs:
The transit company had a massive private dial telephone system
throughout the city, as did most transit carriers. The suburban
carrier and the Reading Railroad used magneto (local battery) phones.
The stuff was upgraded in the 1980s.
It used to be standard that subway tunnels had phones in case a train
broke down and the motorman had to call for assistance. Trains have
radios now. I wonder if the tunnel phones are still there and working
or have been vandalized or eliminated.
Many commuter train tunnels, such as under the Hudson and East Rivers
in NYC, are wired so that cellphones work in them. But many subway
tunnels are not, though transit carriers are negotiating deals with
cellphone companies. A lot of people are opposed to this since they
don't want cell phone yakkers on the subway trains. I agree.
The pioneer automated Metroliner train phone was a prototype for
tunnel antennas and the celluar 'handoff' technology. Getting radio
waves to propagate properly in a tunnel is not easy.
Speaking of modern technology, one thing I dislike on new subway cars
are automated announcements. They are frequent and constant, and give
the train a "1984" atmosphere. In old sci-fi movies the idea of
computerized announcements was always shown as an undesirable aspect
of future life when humans were enslaved. I recently rode an older
subway car without the automation and while the train was noisier
overall, the absence of constant announcements was quite pleasant.
Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 12:37:52 -0700
From: Steven <diespammers@killspammers.com>
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: Western Union's satellite loss
Message-ID: <hao3ei$g08$1@news.eternal-september.org>
hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com wrote:
>> ***** Moderator's Note *****
>>
>> I doubt it was that simple: operators may not have been needed in
>> off-peak hours, but they still had to earn enough to make a living,
>> and telco managers knew that. Automated switch gear, although
>> initially expensive, also meant the operating companies could avoid
>> training costs, wages, and retirement benefits for operators.
>
> Back in the peak days of manual service--the 1910s when telephone
> usage was high but virtually all manual--compensation was very low.
> The young women could only afford to live in rooming houses or doubled
> up. There were virtually no benefits, nor any payroll taxes in those
> days. Most were doing the job only until they found a husband which
> was the norm in those days. The job of a basic A or B operator was
> very simple and required little training, supervision was intensive.
> Even back then the boards had automatic ringing. The more experienced
> operators would handle long distance or supervision.
>
> WW I drove up wages and increased traffic which changed the wage/
> capital balance and motivated Bell to develop panel for big cities and
> use step for community dial offices too small to justify paying an
> operator 24/7. But intermediate offices remain manual for many years.
>
> The cost of converting to dial was substantial. New dial sets had to
> be installed at every subscriber, a big labor cost. Subscribers had
> to be educated on how to use dial; they even sent out people door to
> door to do so plus extensive publicity campaigns. Engineers had to
> study the geography and commerce of the area to plan for future growth
> and capacity requirements. The switch had to be custom designed for
> that location, then built, then installed. Men had to be trained to
> maintain the switch which was much more complex than a switchboard.
> Arrangements for dial connections to/from nearby offices had to be
> arranged, including trunking. Cutover required busying out
> interoffice trunks, holding most calls, providing for emergency calls,
> making the cut, checking it, and resuming service. If an emergency
> call came in the cutover had to wait. (Ref: Cinn Bell writeup on
> cutover). The Bell System cared about its operators and made
> arrangements long in advance to mimize layoffs. Offices planned for
> dial would freeze hiring, and temps used if needed.
>
> Cutover to dial still required many operators for DA, assistance, and
> long distance. (In 1970, Bell pay phones at a resort hotel were
> _manual_, answered by a toll operator on the presumption that any
> guest using a phone would be calling long distance and needed the toll
> operator anyway.)
>
The same thing happened in the early 70's when TSPS came along, GTE in
Calif. dropped over 50% of toll operators.
--
The only good spammer is a dead one!! Have you hunted one down today?
(c) 2009 I Kill Spammers, inc, A Rot in Hell. Co.
Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 18:11:01 -0400
From: tlvp <mPiOsUcB.EtLlLvEp@att.net>
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: Email scams: it's different when it's personal
Message-ID: <op.u1jzwnipo63xbg@acer250.gateway.2wire.net>
On Thu, 08 Oct 2009 12:08:46 -0400, <hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com> wrote,
inter alia:
> ... [much snipped] ...
>
> Web browsers should not be so damn automated that the mere opening of
> an email triggers all sorts of havoc.
I quite agree. No reason to allow iFrames, or ActiveX, or cross-site
scripting, copy/pasting, or the like.
And even most pages that do use these abominations seem to have
more static work-arounds in place so that, even though I refuse such
actions, their pages load usably anyway.
One notable exception (OK, two really):
the T-Mobile Forums and my.t-mobile sites.
Cheers, -- tlvp
--
Avant de repondre, jeter la poubelle, SVP
Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 18:20:58 -0700
From: Sam Spade <sam@coldmail.com>
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: FCC Chairman: Bandwidth Shortage Threatens Future of Cell Phones
Message-ID: <_jRzm.238884$cf6.230927@newsfe16.iad>
Steven wrote:
> Sam Spade wrote:
>
>> John Mayson wrote:
>>
>>> SAN DIEGO - The chairman of the Federal Communications Commission
>>> warned Wednesday of "a looming spectrum crisis" if the government
>>> fails to find ways to come up with more bandwidth for mobile devices.
>>>
>>> Julius Genachowski said the government is tripling the amount of
>>> spectrum available for commercial uses. The problem is that many
>>> industry experts predict wireless traffic will increase 30 times
>>> because of online video and other bandwidth-heavy applications.
>>>
>>> More at... http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,562420,00.html
>>
>>
>> Maybe it will all die a natural death, then folks can rediscover
>> wireline service.
>>
>> ***** Moderator's Note *****
>>
>> There will be a couple of generations before cellular users get tired
>> of their electronic leash: as I've been saying for a long time, the
>> only thing money can really buy is the right to be left alone.
>>
>> I don't know if the backlash will start because of the cellular
>> generation getting older and wiser, or because some efficiency expert
>> will prove how much being constantly turned on impairs real
>> productivity - but it will happen.
>>
>> Bill Horne
>> Moderator
>>
> And we will be going back to SXS, regulation and The Bell System.
>
Well, we are already headed back to the Bell System, wireline or
wireless. Regulation? I think not except perhaps more cops to stop the
highway deaths from wireless "communications."
SXS? Are you even remotely serious? If so, then we can exchange modern
cars for Model Ts and perhaps the highway deaths from the inane use of
wireless will dramatically decrease. (tongue embedded in cheek mode)
Date: Fri, 09 Oct 2009 18:24:02 -0400
From: tlvp <mPiOsUcB.EtLlLvEp@att.net>
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Another T-Mo service to bite the dust
Message-ID: <op.u1j0icdao63xbg@acer250.gateway.2wire.net>
Arriving to my T-Mobile handset's SMS inbox, the afternoon of Oct. 8:
| T-Mobile will no longer offer scheduled or on demand SMS (text)
| alerts as of 10.13.2009. Your other T-Mobile services will not be
| affected by this change.
Mmphh! Five days' notice for such a service reduction? On the heels
of their (now rescinded) $1.50/mo. paper-billing surcharge?
What's the point, now, of the 300 SMS message bucket on my plan? I've
been getting two stock quotes, two News-of-the-Day, and one weather
alert each day -- I'll miss those! Outlandish!
Comments? Advice or suggestions? TIA. And cheers, -- tlvp
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End of The Telecom digest (9 messages)
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