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Message Digest
Volume 28 : Issue 135 : "text" Format
Messages in this Issue:
Re: Verizon selling off phone lines
Re: Verizon selling off phone lines
Re: Verizon selling off phone lines
Re: Verizon selling off phone lines
Re: CO backup power (was Re: FiOS in MDU Buildings
Re: CO backup power (was Re: FiOS in MDU Buildings
Re: CO backup power (was Re: FiOS in MDU Buildings
Re: CO backup power (was Re: FiOS in MDU Buildings)
Re: CO backup power (was Re: FiOS in MDU Buildings
Re: CO backup power (was Re: FiOS in MDU Buildings
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Date: Sun, 17 May 2009 06:36:16 GMT
From: tlvp <PmUiRsGcE.TtHlEvSpE@att.net>
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: Verizon selling off phone lines
Message-ID: <op.ut19zdqawqrt3j@acer250.gateway.2wire.net>
On Thu, 14 May 2009 23:10:39 -0400, John Mayson <john@mayson.us> wrote:
> On Thu, May 14, 2009 at 8:53 AM, <hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com> wrote:
>>
>> I always wondered why Verizon bought out GTE in the first place.
>>
>
> I thought Bell Atlantic and GTE merged to form Verizon?
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GTE#Merger_with_Bell_Atlantic
Isn't Verizon close to 50% owned by Vodaphone?
-- tlvp
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 17 May 2009 09:01:07 -0700
From: Steven Lichter <diespammers@ikillspammers.com>
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: Verizon selling off phone lines
Message-ID: <5pWPl.4227$fD.234@flpi145.ffdc.sbc.com>
tlvp wrote:
> On Thu, 14 May 2009 23:10:39 -0400, John Mayson <john@mayson.us> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, May 14, 2009 at 8:53 AM, <hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> I always wondered why Verizon bought out GTE in the first place.
>>>
>>
>> I thought Bell Atlantic and GTE merged to form Verizon?
>>
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GTE#Merger_with_Bell_Atlantic
>
> Isn't Verizon close to 50% owned by Vodaphone?
>
> -- tlvp
>
Verizon Wireless is 49% owned by Vodaphone.
--
The Only Good Spammer is a Dead one!! Have you hunted one down today?
(c) 2009 I Kill Spammers, Inc. A Rot In Hell Co.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 17 May 2009 07:54:01 -0700
From: Sam Spade <sam@coldmail.com>
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: Verizon selling off phone lines
Message-ID: <eyVPl.89689$ew.38731@newsfe24.iad>
hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com wrote:
> On May 16, 3:08 pm, wleat...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>
>>Western Electric were primarily interested in large multi-office
>>cities where common control capabilities were needed, and [were] not
>>much interested in smaller places where SxS was not only adequate but
>>in many ways superior.
>
>
> Certainly SxS was superior for smaller offices. Common control
> required considerable overhead and was thus uneconomical in smaller
> offices.
>
> Nonetheless, the Bell Labs history on switching documents many
> improvements made to the Strowger unit over the years, [to improve]
> SxS offices. [For example,] in the 1960s electronic front ends were
> added to improve efficiency.
Before that Pacific Telephone, for one BOC, added a No, 5 XBAR unit as
the common control unit for giant, old SxS offices (Pasadena and Los
Angeles Madison come to mind) and the XBAR also served as a local office
code expansion unit.
GTE, OTOH, [chose] this terrible "director" unit, which failed terribly
under traffic loads, and this went on for years in the LA area. The
subscriber could make a non-toll call just fine, but on a toll call he
could wait up to 90 seconds for an ATB signal to appear.
***** Moderator's Note *****
I'd like to hear more about using a #5 for common control with a SxS
office: I didn't know that was possible until now.
Bill Horne
Temporary Moderator
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 17 May 2009 11:48:37 -0700
From: Sam Spade <sam@coldmail.com>
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: Verizon selling off phone lines
Message-ID: <9_YPl.26105$ho7.6707@newsfe10.iad>
Sam Spade wrote:
> Before that Pacific Telephone, for one BOC, added a No, 5 XBAR unit as
> the common control unit for giant, old SxS offices (Pasadena and Los
> Angeles Madison come to mind) and the XBAR also served as a local office
> code expansion unit.
>
> ***** Moderator's Note *****
>
> I'd like to hear more about using a #5 for common control with a SxS
> office: I didn't know that was possible until now.
Maybe I am phrasing it incorrectly. The #5 XBAR was placed in those
large SxS offices to provide the routing of calls from the SxSes.
------------------------------
Date: 17 May 2009 11:19:24 -0400
From: adykes@panix.com (Al Dykes)
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: CO backup power (was Re: FiOS in MDU Buildings
Message-ID: <gup9ts$edu$1@panix5.panix.com>
In article <3ukNl.73527$3k7.36552@newsfe17.iad>,
Sam Spade <sam@coldmail.com> wrote:
>Julian Thomas wrote:
>> On Wed, 6 May 2009 10:37:51 EDT Wesrock@aol.com wrote:
>>
>>> The traditional Central Office had a diesel generator in addition to
>>> its batteries, so a few days is not a problem.
>>
>> IIRC ESS1 (Morris Ill.) had minimal batteries, and a system that was supposed
>> to start the diesels within 1/3 sec after a primary power failure.
>>
>> I have no idea as to how that worked out or was modified.
>
>1/3 of a second to start the sequence perhaps. But, the generator
>wouldn't be ready for awhile after that.
>
>Didn't the batteries power the ESSes in Manhattan for about 4 hours
>before it all died way back when?
As someone that worked in Manhattan, I don't recall a CO failure due to
lack of generators.
ISTR that on 9/11, for the CO near ground zero the generators failed
because the air filters got clogged.
--
Al Dykes
News is something someone wants to suppress, everything else is advertising.
- Lord Northcliffe, publisher of the Daily Mail
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 17 May 2009 16:11:44 +0000 (UTC)
From: danny burstein <dannyb@panix.com>
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: CO backup power (was Re: FiOS in MDU Buildings
Message-ID: <gupd00$enk$1@reader1.panix.com>
In <gup9ts$edu$1@panix5.panix.com> adykes@panix.com (Al Dykes) writes:
>>
>>Didn't the batteries power the ESSes in Manhattan for about 4 hours
>>before it all died way back when?
>As someone that worked in Manhattan, I don't recall a CO failure due to
>lack of generators.
>ISTR that on 9/11, for the CO near ground zero the generators failed
>because the air filters got clogged.
The CLEC/ISP Server Farm in [deleted], a building near Ground Zero,
(not the Verizon CO a couple of hundred feet north) was in the
short term Con Ed (utility power) blackout zone. Their backup
generators kicked in, but... after a couple of hours went out.
The claim at the time (I never saw an official report) was that
one of the cooling pumps for the generators burnt out and
the safeties shut them down.
--
_____________________________________________________
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
dannyb@panix.com
[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 17 May 2009 20:29:34 GMT
From: Howard Eisenhauer <howarde@REMOVECAPShfx.eastlink.ca>
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: CO backup power (was Re: FiOS in MDU Buildings
Message-ID: <a3s015dd1ci8g7ulti86epvj28o3nrbsmb@4ax.com>
On Sun, 17 May 2009 11:35:56 -0400 (EDT), adykes@panix.com (Al Dykes)
wrote:
>In article <3ukNl.73527$3k7.36552@newsfe17.iad>,
>Sam Spade <sam@coldmail.com> wrote:
>>Julian Thomas wrote:
>>> On Wed, 6 May 2009 10:37:51 EDT Wesrock@aol.com wrote:
>>>
>>>> The traditional Central Office had a diesel generator in addition to
>>>> its batteries, so a few days is not a problem.
>>>
>>> IIRC ESS1 (Morris Ill.) had minimal batteries, and a system that was supposed
>>> to start the diesels within 1/3 sec after a primary power failure.
>>>
>>> I have no idea as to how that worked out or was modified.
>>
>>1/3 of a second to start the sequence perhaps. But, the generator
>>wouldn't be ready for awhile after that.
>>
>>Didn't the batteries power the ESSes in Manhattan for about 4 hours
>>before it all died way back when?
>
>As someone that worked in Manhattan, I don't recall a CO failure due to
>lack of generators.
>
>ISTR that on 9/11, for the CO near ground zero the generators failed
>because the air filters got clogged.
There was a CO that went down in the early 90's, not because of a
generator failing to start, but because a contactor failed to close.
IIRC correctly due to power cubical alarms not being completely
connected to the supy system it took literally hours to determine why
the power was out. It wan't until a technician arrived on site, opened
the cabinet door, saw the contactor hadn't pulled in and proceeded to
use a 2x4 he liberated from some construction going on elswhere in the
building to lever the contacts together that service was restored.
I used to have a copy of a PBS news segment on this I sent up the
management train whenever they started making noises about going to
un-manned switches.
H.
------------------------------
Date: 17 May 2009 11:23:53 -0400
From: adykes@panix.com (Al Dykes)
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: CO backup power (was Re: FiOS in MDU Buildings)
Message-ID: <gupa69$6uh$1@panix5.panix.com>
In article <MPG.24727398fadb75b9989a0f@reader.motzarella.org>,
T <kd1s.nospam@cox.nospam.net> wrote:
>In article <gu7ucl$ecd$1@news.motzarella.org>, spfleck@citlink.net
>says...
>>
>> > Memory fades over time, but I recall the basement filled
>> > with the largest lead acid battery farm I'd ever seen. ...
>>
>> The biggest battery backup I've ever seen was in the early 1980's
>> while taking a tour of a AT&T satellite feed [antenna] farm in
>> Kimbles, PA near Lake Wallenpaupak. The dishes were more than huge.
>
>
>Biggest one I ever saw was PaeTech's Providence, RI switch. They had a
>6' high rack that had to be about 30 feet long and maybe 4' or 5' deep
>of batteries for the 5ESS/2000 switch.
>
>***** Moderator's Note *****
>
>Real battery rooms cover the entire floor of the building, as did the
>batteries for the panel exchange in use at Back Bay in Boston until
>1972. They were Exide black monoliths, about 18 inches on a side, and
>they could provide a busy-hour load in excess of 500 amps.
>
>Every time I saw them, I half-expected to find an ape with a bone in his
>hand and "Also Sprach Zarathustra" playing.
>
For the biggest battery room I ever had responsibility for, I always
envisioned a German U-Boat captain and the sountrack from the movie
Das Boot.
--
Al Dykes
News is something someone wants to suppress, everything else is advertising.
- Lord Northcliffe, publisher of the Daily Mail
------------------------------
Date: 17 May 2009 11:44:09 -0400
From: adykes@panix.com (Al Dykes)
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: CO backup power (was Re: FiOS in MDU Buildings
Message-ID: <gupbc9$m9r$1@panix5.panix.com>
In article <hudsonl-ADB4C6.12165010052009@news.isp.giganews.com>,
Hudson Leighton <hudsonl@skypoint.com> wrote:
>In article <2slNl.6854$Lr6.3076@flpi143.ffdc.sbc.com>,
> "Who Me?" <hitchhiker@dont.panic> wrote:
>
>>
>> Not really practical to start a diesel that quickly ... because it
>> (usually) needs to warm up a bit for the speed to stabilize before you
>> cut the load to it. Something like a backup system powered by natural
>> gas may not have that limitation but when you have any battery backup
>> at all, it isn't desirable to start the generator that quickly, to
>> prevent false starts on momentary "hits".
>
>I have see some computer room backup diesels that start up that fast,
>heated cooling system to keep the block at operating temperature, and
>hydraulic starters that will spin fast enough that there is power
>output even if the diesel doesn't start on the 1st rotation.
There are some very inpressive flywheel motor-generator units that
bridge the many seconds it can take for a generator to pick up the
load. ISTR seeing a system with a huge flywheel MG and 3 generators
and no batteries. When the power failed, all three generators were
told to start.
--
Al Dykes
News is something someone wants to suppress, everything else is advertising.
- Lord Northcliffe, publisher of the Daily Mail
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 17 May 2009 20:18:28 -0400
From: "Dr. Barry L. Ornitz" <BLOrnitz48@charter.net>
To: redacted@invalid.telecom.csail.mit.edu
Subject: Re: CO backup power (was Re: FiOS in MDU Buildings
Message-ID: <nP1Ql.44844$Rf7.37399@newsfe21.iad>
"Al Dykes" <adykes@panix.com> wrote in message
news:gupbc9$m9r$1@panix5.panix.com...
> There are some very inpressive flywheel motor-generator units that
> bridge the many seconds it can take for a generator to pick up the
> load. ISTR seeing a system with a huge flywheel MG and 3 generators
> and no batteries. When the power failed, all three generators were
> told to start.
I once worked with a General Electric Model 312 process control computer.
Three-phase power supplied the motor that turned the 32K-word drum
memory. One option, not found on the 312 I worked with, was a
motor/generator hooked to the other end of the drum and a large battery
bank. The three-phase motor turned the drum and the motor/generator
charged the batteries. If the three-phase power failed, the
motor/generator continued to turn the drum, powered by the batteries.
The computer timing was obtained from one track on the drum. Thus as the
batteries were depleted, the computer continued to operate but just ran a
little slower. I thought it was a unique design.
--
73, Dr. Barry L. Ornitz WA4VZQ
BLOrnitz48@charter.net
------------------------------
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