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Subject: TELECOM Digest V23 #477

TELECOM Digest     Sat, 9 Oct 2004 04:46:00 EDT    Volume 23 : Issue 477

Inside This Issue:                            Editor: Patrick A. Townson

    EPIC Alert 11.19 (Monty Solomon)
    VOIP on Cisco 2620 (carverk@hotmail.com)
    911 Address Display Delays Police Response (Wesrock@aol.com)
    Classic Components Removes Representative (distribution@eworldwire.com)
    OSP Identifiers / Verizon Repair (Lincoln J. King-Cliby)
    VOIP on Cisco 2620 (carverk@hotmail.com)
    Re: VOIP Home Connection (Marcus Jervis)
    Re: Cell Phone Attracts Lightning? (Rick Merrill)
    Re: Multipled Pairs: (was: VOIP Home Connection) (AES/newspost)
    Re: Vonage Upgrades Local Unlimited Calling Plan to Premium (M Roberts)
    Re: Paper Tape; Gates at Harvard (Craig Partridge)
    Re: Pennsylvania Railroad's Crew Communication System? (Bob Goudreau)
    Re: A New Phone and Techie Controversy at Verizon (Steve Sobol)

All contents here are copyrighted by Patrick Townson and the
individual writers/correspondents. Articles may be used in other
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included in the fair use quote.  By using -any name or email address-
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we do not want the kind of world that results when no one stands
against crime.   Geoffrey Welsh

               ===========================

See the bottom of this issue for subscription and archive details
and the name of our lawyer; other stuff of interest.  

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 18:04:05 -0400
From: Monty Solomon <monty@roscom.com>
Subject: EPIC Alert 11.19


=======================================================================
                             E P I C  A l e r t
=======================================================================
Volume 11.19                                            October 8, 2004
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

                              Published by the
                Electronic Privacy Information Center (EPIC)
                              Washington, D.C.

             http://www.epic.org/alert/EPIC_Alert_11.19.html

======================================================================
Table of Contents
======================================================================

[1] Coalition Asks Congress to Deliberate 9-11 Comm. Recommendations
[2] EPIC Urges Congress to Protect Social Security Numbers
[3] Appeals Court Votes to Revisit E-Mail Interception Case
[4] Business "Free Speech" Claims Fail to Block Do-Not-Call Registry
[5] California Enacts New, Innovative Privacy Protections
[6] News in Brief
[7] EPIC Bookstore: Losing America
[8] Upcoming Conferences and Events

http://www.epic.org/alert/EPIC_Alert_11.19.html

------------------------------

From: carverk@hotmail.com
Subject: VOIP on Cisco 2620
Date: 8 Oct 2004 15:14:58 -0700
Organization: http://groups.google.com


Hello All..

I got a 2620 with a NM1E2W in the NM Slot and a WIC1B-ST ISDN WIC in a
WAN port.  ISDN line is a normal Res. ISDN line from local Telecom
(1D-2B Channels).

What I would like to do is get a Cisco VOIP phone installed into the
local network and use it to make/recieve local calls over the ISDN WIC
and use my internet Conx. for US/Canada/Other Calls via Vonage or some
other VOIP Provider.

What I'm looking to know is will the 2620 support this? and what Cards
or modules I will need to do this. Since this is a Res. ISDN Line
there is no PBX, just straight to the PSTN..

I have all the current IOS images (12.3.10) for this router so this part
is not a problem.

Thanks.

------------------------------

From: Wesrock@aol.com
Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 18:33:43 EDT
Subject: 911 Address Display Delays Police Response


 
--- From The Daily Oklahoman, Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, for October 8, 2004--

Dispatch error leads police astray 


       Officers were sent to the wrong place in response to a bank
robbery Thursday when the system at the city's dispatch center
displayed an incorrect address, a police spokesman said.

       About 3:45 p.m., an employee from the Bank of Oklahoma branch
inside an Albertsons store on May Avenue near Britton Road called 911
to report a robbery, Oklahoma City Police Lt. Patrick Stewart said.

       Because of the bank's phone system and the way the call was
routed, the address on the dispatcher's computer was for Bank of
Oklahoma at 201 Robert S. Kerr, Stewart said.

       Nine minutes after the first call, officers were sent to the
proper location, 9225 N May.

       The robber was described as a woman in her mid-30s, about 5
feet tall and 200 to 225 pounds, Stewart said. The woman was wearing a
tan baseball cap, a black T-shirt with a U.S. flag on it and rubber
gloves, Stewart said.

             [201 Robert S. Kerr is the address of the bank's
headquarters for Oklahoma City.  May and Britton Road (9225 N. May] is
about 12 miles away.]


Wes Leatherock
wesrock@aol.com
wleathus@yahoo.com

[TELECOM Digest Editor's Note: This is unfortunate, but not unusual,
since it would appear the bank branch was on the *bank's* telephone
system (sort of like a foreign exchange on the bank's centrex) instead
of on the *Albertson's* phone system. Of course there is no guarentee
that the Albertson's phone system was not part of some phone system at
Albertson's headquarters instead of based out of that local store as
well.  So this should be a good lesson to the telecom adminstrators in
our readership. Make certain all *critical* phones at locations other
than your main, directory-listed business location are correctly
listed in 911 databases, etc.  PAT] 

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 18:36:45 -0400
Subject: Classic Components Removes Representative
From: distribution@eworldwire.com


TORRANCE, Calif./EWORLDWIRE/Oct. 8, 2004 --- Effective August 24,
2004, Mario Schroder, is no longer a representitive of Classic
Components Corp. or any of its subsidiaries.


   HTML: http://newsroom.eworldwire.com/wr/100804/10682.htm
   PDF: http://newsroom.eworldwire.com/pdf/100804/10682.pdf
   ONLINE NEWSROOM: http://newsroom.eworldwire.com/2923.htm
   LOGO: http://newsroom.eworldwire.com/2923.htm


CONTACT:
Michelle Dolbec
Classic Components Corp.
PHONE. 310-539-5500
http://www.class-ic.com


Copyright 2004 Eworldwire, All rights reserved.

Press Relase Distribution By EWORLDWIRE
http://www.eworldwire.com
(973)252-6800.

------------------------------

From: chsvideo@hotmail.com (Lincoln J. King-Cliby)
Subject: OSP Identifiers / Verizon Repair
Date: 8 Oct 2004 22:16:54 -0700
Organization: http://groups.google.com


Hi All, 

Question I've pondered for a while: 

I live in Verizon (ex-GTE)'s service area in Southern California and
for years I've noticed that the cross connect/terminal/whatever you
want to call them boxes have a four character code down the sides and
across the doors, in two groups of two characters, for example

XT AI
XT AT
AA BA

How is this code generated? The panel where I saw the AA code is a
near by community served (almost positively) by a different CO.

My other comment on the topic is Verizon is wonderful. Verizon repair
sucks.

In the 15 years we've lived here, we haven't had one problem with
telephone service -- we've never called repair.

About two weeks ago, I was driving by and I noticed that the doors on
XT AI were _wide_ open -- like someone had been working on it and just
decided to leave. I got home, called 611 and got the voice menu,
roughly "Press 1 if this is billing, Press 2 if a problem with your
phones, Press 3 if something else". I press 3 and get a human a short
time later.

I told her what I was calling to report, she says that she'll transfer
me to repair. "I thought I called repair?" says I, "No, you called the
call center." Voice-menu-hell later I get another human.

<call starts>

"May I have the number of the line for which your reporting trouble?"
"Actually I'm calling to report an outside plant issue, but I can give
you this number if you like."
"Uh, yeah, I'll take that one."
"909-xxx-xxxx"
"May I have your name"
"Lincoln King-Cliby K i n g hyphen C l i b y"
"Your name isn't on the account, can I speak with someone who is?"
"No, they aren't available right now, but as I said, this is an OSP
issue."
"I won't be able to do anything to your line without speaking with the
account holder"
"That's fine. My line is fine. Your cross connect box at the
intersection of <street> and <street> is wide open, and that's what
I'm calling to report."
(repeat this info four or five more times for him) 
"We'll get someone out to look at it. Thank you for calling Verizon."

Four days later the box was still open. This time I find a 1-800
repair number on Verizon's website, hoping that would skip the call
center detour.

First call: "do dah dee. Thank you for calling Verizon. (silence)",
hang up hit redial.
Second call: "do dah dee. Thank you for calling Verizon Hawaii.", hang
up hit redial.
Third call: "do dah dee. Thank you for calling Verizon New York.",
hang up hit redial.
Fourth call: same as the first. 
Fifth call: do dah dee. Thank you for calling Verizon. (same menu as
611).

[It's quite reassuring to know that Verizon -- the phone company --
can't even make sure that they give me the proper greeting. All were
to the exact same number, using the redial button on my phone]

This time, I choose the "trouble with phones" option and then 0'ed-out
of the ensuing checklist menu, and I get a very plesant woman. Tell
her what I'm calling to report. She asks for my phone number anyways,
I give it to her, she also asks for my name."

I give her all of the details I gave the original guy plus the ID# (XT
AI) that I had confirmed in the meantime. While she's entering the
details, I comment on how I had called it in earlier in the week and
was concerned that it was still open due to the number of lines
present [this is the ~5'x5'x2' size] and she agrees. She said that she
would make sure it got fixed the next morning and asked "Would you
like them to call you, or swing by your house or something when
they're finished?" (!) I declined the offer saying that I'd know when
I drove by and saw it closed up.

The next morning it was, indeed, closed, and when I got home there was
a voice mail from a Verizon lineman saying that it was closed and
someone "probably just forgot to close it".

Any ideas why Verizon would allow the thing to remain open for as long
as they did? Do you supose I can now get a self-guided tour of my
central office given their new plant security procedures?


Lincoln

[TELECOM Digest Editor's Note: The problem was you blew their customer
service routine. Had you called the *right number* to start with --
and of course you could not, it is a non-published, secret number, to
prevent telco from recieving 'crank calls' from cutomers who insist on
'speaking to someone who knows something about anything' -- the box
would have been closed up within a few minutes of your first
call. Telco has no provision for any subscriber to call them regards
anything other than their personal phone line/number. Regards anything
to do with any of their own infrastructure, you are only a customer,
what would you know about any of that stuff ...

This reminds me of a situation about 1970 or so: I called in to report
that an inter-office trunk (between two central offices) was in
trouble. I was making calls sort of regularly between my house and
someone in another (local) C.O.  Always very late at night. I would
dial the number, not only would the call not go through, I always
would get a hideous and loud 'rattling' noise in my ear. Now and
again, rarely I would get through on the first try. This never
happened on calls I would make to that (inter-C.O.) number during the
day, only late at night.

It took me a *long time* to get anyone at telco to listen to me or
act on it. Finally I got a tech who called me back. I described the
problem to him, he asked if I had a second line there (I did), and he
said 'please do me a favor ... the next time that happens, *put that
line on hold, keep it on hold* and call me on (private, internal
number) from your other line. It happened a few hours later; I kept
the troubled line on hold and called the guy. He went in the frames,
found the line, and repaired it. Something to do with a loose contact.
He came back on line with me, and said 'okay, drop that connection and
I will tell you what I found.' It appears it was the 'first selected
trunk' in a group of several circuits running from the central office
I was in to the central office I was trying to reach. Since it was 
the 'first selection', during the day in busy hours, it was always 
being seized. One seizure after another. When a subscriber tried to
make a call (to that central office from my central office) it was
only rarely the subscriber would land on that first selected trunk. 
When he did, he would always get that same hassle I did, but he would
hang up and dial again (and land on some other circuit in the process)
and his call would go though okay. In the meantime, some third person
making a call would get the bad line, hang up and try again, etc. But
late at night, when there was no inter-office traffic to speak of, 
the same subscriber (myself) would get the same troubled trunk over
and over. The tech fixed it so no one had the problem any further. I
do not know if he actually repaired it, or just busied it out, but
there was no further problems with it. The hassle I had was finding
someone -- anyone -- willing to listen and take action on it until
that technician took pity on me. 

I suspect, Lincoln, that was your problem also. It was only when some
clerk or call-taker realized that your inquiry was not the usual crank
call they so often receive and decided to pass it along to someone who
could cure the problem that it got handled.   PAT]

------------------------------

From: carverk@hotmail.com
Subject: VOIP on Cisco 2620
Date: 8 Oct 2004 16:01:32 -0700
Organization: http://groups.google.com


Hello all,

I got a 2620 with a NM1E2W in the NM Slot and a WIC1B-ST ISDN WIC in a
WAN port.  ISDN line is a normal Res. ISDN line from local Telecom
(1D-2B Channels).

What I would like to do is get a Cisco VOIP phone installed into the
local network and use it to make/recieve local calls over the ISDN WIC
and use my internet Conx. for US/Canada/Other Calls via Vonage or some
other VOIP Provider.

What I'm looking to know is will the 2620 support this? and what Cards
or modules I will need to do this. Since this is a Res. ISDN Line
there is no PBX, just straight to the PSTN..

I have all the current IOS images (12.3.10) for this router so this
part is not a problem.

Thanks.

------------------------------

From: Marcus Jervis <marcusjervis@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: VOIP Home Connection
Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 20:18:46 +0000


Rick Merrill <RickMerrill@comTHROW.net> wrote:

>Andy G. wrote:

>> I am considering signing up for VOIP service and have been reading
>> websites of the various providers to try to figure out how to wire my
>> whole house.  According to Vonage, you can run a wire from the adapter
>> to a phone jack and (as long as the line is disconnected totally from
>> the phone co. and there is no curerent) all jacks would work.  I asked
>> Verizon about this, they said that it's not supported.

> They cannot "support it" because it involves your inside wiring and
> Because The Telephone Adapter (TA) can only drive 1 Ringer Equivalent.
> Some TA may be able to drive 3 RE, according to my research. So you
> have to add up all the RE in your house correctly or else you may blow
> the TA when your phone rings.

> Of course you have to make darn sure that your in-house wiring
> connects to NOTHING else: unplug all phones until there is No
> resistance whatsoever across the phone lines. Then plug in the TA and
> one (1) phone.

The solution to this is to use something like the Proctor Long Loop
Adapter (46222 1 line or 46224 4 lines).  Unfortunately, Proctor went
out of business on 10/31/03.  If you go to www.proctorinc.com you can
look at details on those products, but I know they have none in the
stock they may still be trying to sell off.  Perhaps you can find one
on a used equipment market.  I've seen their stuff on Ebay
occasionally.

One of these will plug in to anyplace that supports a standard
single-line phone and boost the DC current and AC ringing voltage up
to standard telco line levels, so you can drive a standard 5 ringers
over a 1900 ohm loop, if you wish.

You might check Viking (http://www.vikingelectronics.com/) for a
similar competetive product.

Ohmygawsh!  Just checked Viking's web site, and up front on their home
page they are talking about replacements for Proctor products.  I know
in the past they had a "ringing amplifier" that would probably do the
trick, as long as you weren't trying to extend the loop several miles
off premises.  It sounds like a new replacement will also have the
standard 48vdc loop voltage, if you need it.

------------------------------

From: Rick Merrill <RickMerrill@comTHROW.net>
Subject: Re: Cell Phone Attracts Lightning?
Organization: Comcast Online
Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 20:52:14 GMT


Truth wrote:

>>> In NO WAY can a cellphone being used at a gas station cause an
>>> explosion.

>> (The MythBusters TV show did an episode on cell phones and gas
>> stations.  Turns out that people getting in and out of the car sliding
>> on the seat often generate a static charge, and that is the primary
>> cause of most gas station fires,

> Wrong. Even THAT theory is bullshit and they should have pointed that
> out as well on the program since they apparently didn't make it clear
> to ALL the viewers.

> I purposely allow a static shock between me and the car when filling
> up with gas just to show people with me how ridiculous and full of
> shit the urban legend is.

Yeah, and you're using a vapor control gas pump!

------------------------------

From: AES/newspost <siegman@stanford.edu>
Subject: Re: Multipled Pairs: (was: VOIP Home Connection)
Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 15:51:25 -0700


In article <telecom23.476.12@telecom-digest.org>, Nick Landsberg
<SPAMhukolauTRAP@SPAMworldnetTRAP.att.net> wrote:

>> wires) makes an appearance. Its very common in older outside plant
>> (dating back, lets say to the 1940-50 era) in dense inner city areas,
>> to do it that way: string one cable with maybe 500 pairs therein
>> down the alley, open each pair at each possible location or house,
>> and attach it to the demarc. In the 1940-50 era, things were 'different'

For those of us not familiar with the hardware, did these "demarcs"
somehow come with all 500 pairs already pre-attached somehow?  Or was
there some quick and simple one-step process that made it easy to
attach all 500 pairs to each demarc in one step?

I'm having a hard time visualizing the situation where an installer
would laboriously connect all 500 pairs, one at a time, to each and
every demarc at each and every house, when only one or a few pairs
were likely to be needed in that house . . . ???

[TELECOM Digest Editor's Note: You need to go back to the early 
years of the twentieth century, the early 1900's when not only was
the telephone a new thing, but so were 'highrise' apartment buildings.
Until elevators were common-place, you did not see office or apartment
buildings more than three or four stories tall. But in the 1920's, in
Chicago, for example, there was a renaissance of office/apartment
building highrise construction; many huge, very tall (for their time)
buildings. This was because the buildings built in the the 1870's 
following the Great Fire were now themselves over fifty years old and
getting sort of decrepit. This early twentieth century reneissance of
building happened likewise in New York City and other major
metropolitan (read, 'dense' population) areas. 

Telco tended to build and install very large wooden 'cabinets' (with
doors which could be lifted off). Actually, I think Western Electric
built them and did the initial wiring. All older 'highrise' buildings
(fifty to eighty or a hundred years old) still have vestiges of
Western Electric wooden cabinets in their basement somewhere which
serve as the 'demarcs' for that location. I say this mainly as a
tribute to how good the workman- ship was in those long-ago times. You
will still see a lot of these older buildings in metropolitan 'inner
city' areas, buildings which have been there for decades, with the
'permanent' demarc cabinets in the basement. I am *not* speaking now
about the 'newer' (less than twenty or thirty year old) residential
developments, etc.

In a time when labor was cheap (and for many years, Bell did not have
any unions either; people talk about Sprint being a non-union shop,
but for its first half century, 1878 through the middle	1920's) Bell
was very *anti-union* as well.) Remind me to tell you sometime about
Myrtle Murphy, the very first union steward for telephone operators
in the Chicago Franklin office, and how the company harrassed her and
made her life miserable. So anyway, all the cabling was done many
years ago, before any of us can remember. Now the outside plant tech
is told Mrs. Smith wants a telephone, we have assigned her pair 87 on
cable 2037 out of the Rogers Park central office, and pair 87 also
shows up on cable 2037 at (address) and (address) and (address). So
the tech goes and takes pair 87 and 'punches it down on the block'
as needed where Mrs. Smith is located and removes it from the punch
down block at the other locations as needed. All the hard, laborious
and time consuming work was done many years ago mostly by non-union
labor.  PAT]

------------------------------

From: markrobt@comcast.net (Mark Roberts)
Subject: Re: Vonage Upgrades Local Unlimited Calling Plan to Premium
Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 22:58:30 -0000
Organization: 1.94 meters


Dave Close <dave@compata.com> had written:

> Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> writes:
 
>> Let us know when all numbers within the NANP can be dialed without any
>> charge other than that for local phone service.

> /I/ can dial all calls to anywhere in the US or Canada without extra
> charge. The Caribbean is extra. I dial all of them as 11 digits, both
> on my Sprint PCS and my Vonage lines. 

On your PCS, you should be able to dial them as 10 digits. On both
SPCS and ATTWS, I am routinely able to dial all calls without the '1'.

The local/zoned distinction is increasingly becoming irrelevant. It
makes no sense on my Vonage service, and it increasingly makes less
sense on the cellular services. On my SBC measured-unit service,
there's a tangle between "local", "local toll" (provided by Sprint
on one line, SBC on the other), and "long-distance".

In fact, Vonage does make a local/long-distance distinction, but on
most service plans, it doesn't make a difference. Strangely, Vonage
does not consider "925" a local area code for me, even though it's
about four blocks away from my home.

I could have had an Oakland number for my Vonage service, but
instead picked a Berkeley number for esthetic reasons. It mostly
seems to matter with respect to who's "local toll" when calling me.

I never thought I would advocate this, but the time may have come
simply to require *all* calls to be dialed with 10 digits, thus
dispensing with the '1'.


Mark Roberts | "Money news, sponsored by Dame Edna." --
Oakland, Cal.|  yes, that's really how KCBS "All-News 740" introduced 
NO HTML MAIL |  its 6:55 am business report on September 15, 2004

------------------------------

From: Craig Partridge <craigp@TheWorld.com>
Subject: Re: Paper Tape; Gates at Harvard
Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 16:00:43 UTC
Organization: The World : www.TheWorld.com : Since 1989


W Randolph Franklin <franklin@harv10.arpa> writes:

> BTW, I never talked to him.  How many grad students talk to undergrads
> who wander in and out?  There may be a lesson here.

But Gates was remembered.  One of his faculty instructors remembered
him as the guy who used to fall asleep in class, wake up, look at the
blackboard and ask a cogent question.

> The HW has certainly improved from the days of 10cps i/o (plus a line
> printer), core memories with well under 1 MB, disks with 10MB, etc.
> However, I can't say that the SW is much better today.  Harvard
> researchers had developed an object oriented language, EL/1, which had
> comparable power to C++ (lacked a few features, but had a few other
> features).  Defining new classes in EL/1, including their interactions
> with other classes, was just as hard as it is in C++.

I think this is underselling EL/1's goals.  As I recall it (along with
PPL -- Polymorphic Programming Language) were attempts to create fully
extensible languages -- such that you could (and in one class did)
transform EL/1 into a programming language for a completely new
computer language.  (Very weird experience to morph a system that
way).

Craig Partridge AB '83

------------------------------

From: Bob Goudreau <Withheld on request>
Subject: Re: Pennsylvania Railroad's Crew Communication System?
Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2004 22:21:21 -0400


[Please withhold my email address as usual.]
 

Lisa Hancock wrote:

> David Clayton wrote:

>> Of course, I won't mention that a lot of these things seemed to have 
>> happened since the state privatised the train system about 10 years ago.

> There are elements in the U.S. in think privitizing Amtrak will be 
> more efficient. They ignore the many experiences of the above in the 
> United Kingdom and other countries... 

Actually, it is the persistent critics of such privatizations that
tend to conveniently ignore what actually happened.  For example,
neither Britain nor Australia has seen a decline in rail safety since
privatization of various elements of their railway systems, contrary
to the statist party line.  See
http://www.cts.cv.imperial.ac.uk/documents/publications/iccts00410.pdf
and http://www.atsb.gov.au/rail/pdf/fatalities_international.pdf, for
instance.

Similar safety scares preceded and accompanied other loosenings of
government-imposed straitjackets, yet they too proved to be bogus.
Contrary to the popular perception of the uninformed, the US airline
industry did not become more dangerous after airline deregulation in
the late 1970s; the fatality rate per passenger-mile continued (and
still continues) to decline.  Likewise, blood-covered highways were
predicted by some of the more strident "safety Nazis" when the 55 mph
national speed limit was loosened to 65 mph in the mid-1980s and then
rescinded entirely a decade later (which let states return to setting
their own limits, most of which have reverted to 70 or 75 mph).  Yet
the US fatality rate per vehicle-mile traveled has continued the long
secular decline that began in the early part of the 20th century.

> We may end up with govt owned airlines given how so many are bankrupt. 

Fortunately, such an "Amtrak in the sky" seems extremely unlikely.
Some airlines have pledged assets as security for their emergency
government loans, and some or all of them could eventually end up in
full bankruptcy liquidation (i.e., Chapter 7, not Chapter 11).  In
that case, the federal government would indeed end up with those
assets (aircraft, maintenance facilities, etc.).  But such foreclosed
assets are usually auctioned off by the government, not reconstituted
as government-run agencies.  There are successful airlines that would
be happy to pick up such assets at bargain prices, after all.

Bob Goudreau
Cary, NC

------------------------------

From: Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net>
Subject: Re: A New Phone and Techie Controversy at Verizon
Date: Fri, 08 Oct 2004 12:20:00 -0700
Organization: Glorb Internet Services, http://www.glorb.com


Truth wrote:

> My cellphone doesn't HAVE a screen at all, 

Now, this is funny. What 50-year-old piece of junk do you have that doesn't 
have a screen? Even the old analog Motorola MicroTACs have screens.

> It amazes me how stupid humans really are.

No comment. :)

JustThe.net Internet & New Media Services, http://JustThe.net/
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TELECOM Digest is an electronic journal devoted mostly but not
exclusively to telecommunications topics. It is circulated anywhere
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*************************************************************************
*   TELECOM Digest is partially funded by a grant from                  *
*   Judith Oppenheimer, President of ICB Inc. and purveyor of accurate  *
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*   Views expressed herein should not be construed as representing      *
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Copyright 2004 ICB, Inc. and TELECOM Digest. All rights reserved.
Our attorney is Bill Levant, of Blue Bell, PA.

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Finally, the Digest is funded by gifts from generous readers such as
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All opinions expressed herein are deemed to be those of the
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End of TELECOM Digest V23 #477
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